Monday, May 09, 2005

Can't Touch This

Hello boys and girls, today we're going to talk about Shomer Negiah! First allow me to apologize for the cliched title of this blog, but I just couldn't think of something better (although I almost went with "Well, at least im Homo-Negiah!"). I must say I'm very happy with the response the last two dating-related blogs got. So why quit while I'm hot? (for all of you who still check in to find out about my personal life there's still not much to tell, I'll let you know if there is.)
I was recently talking to a female friend of mine who told me how she and her BF of one month broke negiah in a fit of passion (and if you are going to break it, a fit of passion is always the way to go). He is basically yeshivaish (as he learns in Yeshiva), and she is quite frum as well. Needless to say a good deal of guilt followed. They talked about it, realized it was a mistake and have been shomer for the last 3 weeks, and intend to stay that way. I wish them the best, and hope they succeed, but as they don't appear to be getting engaged soon, I'm highly skeptical that they'll never break S"N again until they're married (unless one of them didn't enjoy the experience, then it should be smooth sailing:). It's not that I doubt their sincerity, it's that I believe in the overcoming power of testosterone and estrogine. Also, it seems the further away from 19 we get, the less shomer negiah we are.
I remember that after shana-aleph a great deal of my friends were Shomer, myself included. In fact, I think I went a good 16 months straight at one point. Now it seems barely any of my friends are shomer(my married friends dont count). In fact I have only one friend who touched his wife for the very first time on their wedding night, and another who dated the girl in high school and they weren't shomer, but after Israel they were for over a year till they got engaged (though a good deal of the relationship was long distance, but I still think they would have made it otherwise). They get special props -(it's incredibly hard to become shomer once you've really enjoyed not being shomer with a specific person). I also have many friends, married and single, who give/gave the impression that they're shomer, but when no ones looking are/were all over each other like Bert and Ernie when the lights go out (oh don't be so shocked, it's only a matter of time before they're outed for real). I certainly did this as well, and it made me quite guilty sometimes. Basically we may assume a lot of people are shomer, but the harsh reality is that they are not. I was a little surprised to find out that some people I thought were shomer, played "patty-cake", "Dr. Dr.", and Twister when no one was looking.
Now I understand that post Israel, many of us are filled with religious fervor, and are more inspired, thus making it easier to keep our hands to ourselves. But it seems that for the overwhelming majority it is nearly impossible to be shomer, especially if you're dating for more than a few months before marriage. I know of exactly 0 couples who were together for more than a year before their wedding that managed to stay Shomer throughout their whole relationship (so that knocks out the above couple). So basically, with the exception of that one friend, I know no one who never touched his/her wife/husband before their wedding. Now I'm not saying this is impossible, I'm just saying I don't know of anyone who's made it- and I love it when one asks very frum ppl who you know dated for a while before the wedding about this stuff and they give you the run around ("Well, ya know it's tough..." or "Hey, we're only human.." or , and my personal favorite "We were basically good...except on Rosh Chodesh"); who you kidding?
I must go on the record by saying I think shomer negiah is a very good thing, and certainly helps a marriage in getting used to nidah (or so I've been told). It is very easy to get into a long term relationship and let the physical aspects take it over, shirking other issues (of this I am regretfully guilty as well). Sometimes the physical can become the whole relationship, and then you're in really deep dog doo. But I'm digressing/rambling (a side effect of blogging), as I want the focus to be more on reasoning.
I think a big part of it is that today, many couples date much longer than in the past, making negiah all the more harder. In Talmudic times courtships were a fraction of what they were today. You met the girl at breakfast, were engaged by lunch, and married by dinner, and hopefully desert went well; so negiah, not so tough.
Some people feel shomer negiah is illogical, and I disagree with this as well. I think it's perfectly logical, and if kept, can ensure a healthier marriage, as one has a much better chance of marrying someone more for their neshama, and less for their dinglehoppers and knick-knack-pattywacks. I am all for S"N, as I'm sure many people are, but that doesn't make it easy to hold. In the future, should I be in a real relationship again, I do hope to be able to maintain S"N, but also hope that if I can't, I don't pretend like I am. I'm not so into the idea of pretending to be something I'm not, and would rather accept who I am and strive to be better.
I think there's a lot more I can say on this issue, but this blog's getting a wee bit long, so I'll save the rest of my opinions for the comments page. But before I go I hope you weren't expecting some sort of firm resolution. The fact is most people don't seem to be able to keep S"N, whether they're trying to keep it or not. I guess if we all became lepers it would be a lot easier..... Actually it wouldn't, cause If WE ALL were lepers then it wouldn't be a big deal if we touched, except for the halacha aspect of it, but hey, if you got leperacy and you can get some, I say go for it.
OK, terrific.
That's all for now, I leave it to you.

7 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

check out
www.shomernegiah.blogspot.com

Monday, May 09, 2005  
Blogger Hopefool said...

Woh- that blog is very interesting. I don't agree with everything she says, although she does strengthen some points I make (she basically alludes that if she meets the right person she probably won't be shomer). And she does a good job of subtley pointing out that it's basically ok for women to masturbate- but that's a different blog.

Monday, May 09, 2005  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i know alot of individuals who claim to be shomer and are far from it, but the truth is, that it really isnt anyone else's business. its between them and g-d and as long as pple are trying and striving to be shomer and actually keep it for real this time around, i think that is all that matters. I dont think it is a cut and dry thing in g-ds eyes, and i dont think that we should mock pple who are "fakely shomer", at least THEY r trying. Its not "accepting who u r " by saying you just arent shomer and thats that, its giving up on ur spiritual growth.

Tuesday, May 10, 2005  
Blogger The Fades said...

I love being shomer b/c I was always bad at "making moves" anyway.

Tuesday, May 10, 2005  
Blogger Hopefool said...

Fine points anonymous. But I was in no way trying to mock anyone. I'm just sayin' I'd rather not pretend to be something I'm not. The hypocricy builds and builds, and can be too much of a burden. And I didn't say "IM accepting who I am" by not being shomer. In fact I said I'd prefer to work on it, just not lie about it if I break it.

Tuesday, May 10, 2005  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry dude, totally disagree. S"N (as you write it) is crap and terrible. It makes kids marry younger and younger when they shouldn't be married. How can a 21/22 year old support a family right out of college?
And why build the fence around touching? if you want to say no sex, then say no sex! why not build the fence even further out and say no talking to girls until you are READY to get married or even ARE married. And no where in the torah does it even say you can't have sex with a girl before marriage. The only thing the torah says is "don't take a jewish prostitute into your house", and from that they say no pre-marital sex,and from that they say no fooling around, and from that they say no touching at all. I just don't agree with it.

Wednesday, May 11, 2005  
Blogger Hopefool said...

I definetly agree with that. There is certainly something romantic about being shomer, and touching for the first under the chupah or Yichud room. Maybe when you hook up with a Jewish girl, you cheapen her, thereby making her a prostitute. OK, that may be a stretch but there is logic in it.
I think the Rebbeim instituted no touching in order to prevent sex or other sexual acts that may cause a man to waste semen (which is not allowed according to the Torah). Because, believe me, it might all just start with an innocent touch on the hand, and before you know it, when you hang out clothes become optional.

Wednesday, May 11, 2005  

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